162 replies to this topic

[Lord Flashheart]

Ahh... This again

[Flying_Pie]

I'm glad half of these people don't really fly planes...

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

if you people are flying planes without learning bernoule's principle then I'm scared to fly now..

[AA752]

Flying_Pie1104, on Jan 1 2007, 12:57 PM, said:

I'm glad half of these people don't really fly planes...

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

if you people are flying planes without learning bernoule's principle then I'm scared to fly now..

Read the article dolbinau posted a link to a page back. You'll understand.

Edited by AA752, 01 January 2007 - 04:05 PM.

[Chief_Bean]

Flying_Pie1104, on Jan 1 2007, 08:57 PM, said:

I'm glad half of these people don't really fly planes...

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

if you people are flying planes without learning bernoule's principle then I'm scared to fly now..

Read the ###### thread!

I think this topic should locked

[Penguin.]

Hey Pie, if you're learning Bernoulli's principle without learning Newton's Laws of Motion, then I'm scared for the future of our society.

That, and add in the spelling issue, kinda makes me wonder if YOU even learned it.

[F16-USAF]

Penguin., on Jan 1 2007, 04:33 PM, said:

Hey Pie, if you're learning Bernoulli's principle without learning Newton's Laws of Motion, then I'm scared for the future of our society.

That, and add in the spelling issue, kinda makes me wonder if YOU even learned it.

+1  

[F16-USAF]

Chief_Bean, on Jan 1 2007, 01:17 PM, said:

N3123V, on Jan 1 2007, 06:10 PM, said:

NOW PIN THIS ###### THREAD FOR ALL THE FUTURE N00BS!

And in answer to the person who asked "When will this thread appear again?" The answer is: The next time another n00b joins

hey i take offense to that!!!!

next thread about this will be up in approx. 5 days 3 hrs 27 mins and 32.5 seconds

[dolbinau]

Flying_Pie1104, on Jan 2 2007, 07:57 AM, said:

I'm glad half of these people don't really fly planes...

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

if you people are flying planes without learning bernoule's principle then I'm scared to fly now..

http://www.straightd...mns/060203.html

[FL050]

Westjet737, on Jan 1 2007, 02:47 AM, said:

Its just like walking the wrong way on an escalator. If you walk the wrong way at the speed the escaltor is going but oppoiste you will find you actully do not move! Amazing!!

No, it is NOTHING like that.  

Why?  Because your legs control how you fast you move.  On an aircraft, the wheels have no say in how fast the aircraft goes, the engines do.  The wheels are simply there to allow the aircraft to move - they DO NOT have any say on how fast the aircraft goes.

The aircraft will move because the belt follows the speed of the wheels - NOT the aircraft.  The belt will cancel out how fast the wheels are going, but remember that the wheels don't control the speed of the aircraft - the engines and excess thrust do.  

The wheels and the belt have NOTHING to do with how much airflow is going over the wings.

Quote

according to it, you could pretend the wheels arn't even attached to the aircraft at all, for you don't need them to power anything.

Pretend... that is the way it actually is

Quote

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Edited by FL050, 01 January 2007 - 06:02 PM.

[wyoairbus]

Flying_Pie1104, on Jan 1 2007, 03:57 PM, said:

I'm glad half of these people don't really fly planes...

if the plane has no AIRSPEED, then there's no flippin way it'll takeoff. if you switch it around and give a 737 130kt winds, but the 737 stays still, the 737 can take off. But if the 737 is going 130kt on a conveyor belt and there's no airflow over the wing then how will it takeoff?

if you people are flying planes without learning bernoule's principle then I'm scared to fly now..

I was thinking this at first too but it is incorrect, maybe YOU shouldnt ever fly a plane, look at doulbinau's article.


A plane CAN take-off on a conveyor belt, no matter how fast the belt is moving.

All the wheels do on a plane is keep it off the ground, so pretend they aren't even there. The plane will throttle off an jet off gaining normal speed, wheels not having anything to do with it.


End of discussion.

[AA752]

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

[FL050]

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

[Chief_Bean]

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:28 PM, said:

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

Is it the aircraft's airspeed relative to the air, not the speed of the air passing it?   

Edited by Chief_Bean, 02 January 2007 - 12:35 PM.

[FL050]

Chief_Bean, on Jan 2 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:28 PM, said:

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

Is it the aircraft's airspeed relative to the air, not the speed of the air passing it?   

Moreso yes.

It measures the aircrafts speed relative to the air in which it is moving.  Airspeed is measured through the amount of ram air pressure inside the pitot tube - which has no bearing on how much lift the wing is generating.

What if you had a tailwind while at cruise?  The pitot tube would read XXX knots regardless because it is ram air pressure on the pitot tube from which the AS is derived.  Same thing as a headwind, although it would indicate a little higher than a tailwind because of the amount of air the headwind is pushing more air into the pitot tube.

[Chief_Bean]

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:50 PM, said:

Chief_Bean, on Jan 2 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:28 PM, said:

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

Is it the aircraft's airspeed relative to the air, not the speed of the air passing it?   

Moreso yes.

It measures the aircrafts speed relative to the air in which it is moving.  Airspeed is measured through the amount of ram air pressure inside the pitot tube - which has no bearing on how much lift the wing is generating.

What if you had a tailwind while at cruise?  The pitot tube would read XXX knots regardless because it is ram air pressure on the pitot tube from which the AS is derived.  Same thing as a headwind, although it would indicate a little higher than a tailwind because of the amount of air the headwind is pushing more air into the pitot tube.

Oh so wind direction/speed only has a slight effect?

[AA752]

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 09:50 AM, said:

Chief_Bean, on Jan 2 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:28 PM, said:

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

Is it the aircraft's airspeed relative to the air, not the speed of the air passing it?   

Moreso yes.

It measures the aircrafts speed relative to the air in which it is moving.  Airspeed is measured through the amount of ram air pressure inside the pitot tube - which has no bearing on how much lift the wing is generating.

What if you had a tailwind while at cruise?  The pitot tube would read XXX knots regardless because it is ram air pressure on the pitot tube from which the AS is derived.  Same thing as a headwind, although it would indicate a little higher than a tailwind because of the amount of air the headwind is pushing more air into the pitot tube.

Right, because if it's traveling 180 knots in a tailwind the wind is still traveling over the aircraft at 180 knots. The tailwind only affects the groundspeed of the aircraft. Same thing with a headwind. Will a real pilot please back me up?

You said it yourself, it's the speed of the aircraft relative to the surrounding air. That's the same thing as the speed of the air passing the aircraft. Think of a windtunnel. If they have a full sized model of a small aircraft and they want to simulate a cruise at 110 knots, they are going to tell the windtunnel to start blowing wind at 110 knots. You're saying a tailwind wouln't register because it is not being read by the pitot tube, but a headwind will affect it slightly. Neither will. Put a toy boat in a stream. It will float down river but it won't create a wake since it is not moving "relative to the water."

Edited by AA752, 02 January 2007 - 01:30 PM.

[Chief_Bean]

AA752, on Jan 2 2007, 06:12 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 09:50 AM, said:

Chief_Bean, on Jan 2 2007, 12:34 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 2 2007, 05:28 PM, said:

AA752, on Jan 1 2007, 08:06 PM, said:

FL050, on Jan 1 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Since always. I'm not saying it can't take off, it can. But...yeah. Airspeed is the speed of the air going past the plane.

You want to do some research and come back to answer that question?

Is it the aircraft's airspeed relative to the air, not the speed of the air passing it?   

Moreso yes.

It measures the aircrafts speed relative to the air in which it is moving.  Airspeed is measured through the amount of ram air pressure inside the pitot tube - which has no bearing on how much lift the wing is generating.

What if you had a tailwind while at cruise?  The pitot tube would read XXX knots regardless because it is ram air pressure on the pitot tube from which the AS is derived.  Same thing as a headwind, although it would indicate a little higher than a tailwind because of the amount of air the headwind is pushing more air into the pitot tube.

Right, because if it's traveling 180 knots in a tailwind the wind is still traveling over the aircraft at 180 knots. The tailwind only affects the groundspeed of the aircraft. Same thing with a headwind. Will a real pilot please back me up?

He's a real pilot

[AA752]

Chief_Bean, on Jan 2 2007, 10:15 AM, said:

He's a real pilot

Well then I apologise for disagreeing with you FL050, but I still do Since you're a real pilot then you should know airspeed is a comparison of the pressure measured from the pitot tube and static (motionless) pressure taken from the static port. Essentially, it is comparing the pressure of still air with the ammount of air being rammed into the pitot tube, so the headwind or tailwind has no bearing on it, and the airspeed is the ammount of air passing over the aircraft.

Edited by AA752, 02 January 2007 - 01:26 PM.

[TONYH21]

No.

[AA752]

You wanted proof from reasearch, FL050, this is taken directly from an article about engine power from Van's Aircraft's website.

"True Air Speed - the velocity of the air passing by the airframe"

Source: http://www.vansaircr...df/hp_limts.pdf

True airspeed is just the indicated airspeed corrected for nonstandard pressures and temperatures, but it is still airspeed!

I hope this answers your question of:

Quote

Since when did airspeed measure how much air is going over the wings?

Edited by AA752, 02 January 2007 - 02:08 PM.