85 replies to this topic

[Captain-Amar]

NWilkinson, on Mar 5 2009, 01:08 AM, said:

FL050, on Mar 4 2009, 01:36 PM, said:

But the autopilot uses the Radio Altimeter as it's reference for Autoland; of which the plane was on Autoland sequence until it practically stalled and the pilots kicked it off.

It is still pilot error for not monitoring the autopilot.

I guarantee you, most of the blame will be put on pilot error for not monitoring the autopilot.  Contributing factors would be a faulty RA.  Unless the autopilot would not shut off, CFIT is always pilot error.

Remember, most, if not all, ILS approaches cross the threshold at about 50-100 feet...   if the altimeters read "X" feet, the aircraft perfectly on the glide slope, and -8 feet on the RA, noticed the plane behaving erratically, the AP should have been immediately disconnected and then either continue the approach by hand or execute a missed approach.  Airplanes don't stall at Vref, they stall much much lower, the crew should have had adequate time to notice the discrepancy and take appropriate action.

Now, please refresh my memory..  where did the aircraft crash in relation to the runway?

May I add they are looking into actually blaming THY aswell for not fixing the faulty altimiter because it apperently has happend before.

Edited by Captain-Amar, 04 March 2009 - 09:30 PM.

[Cactus]

Captain-Amar, on Mar 4 2009, 09:30 PM, said:

May I add they are looking into actually blaming THY aswell for not fixing the faulty altimiter because it apperently has happend before.

A repeat snag does not automatically shift blame to the flight crew. If the Captain accepted the use of the aircraft under MEL conditions, or, if it failed during cruise -- the flight crew is still responsible for correctly dealing with the issues at hand.

[Captain-Amar]

Duke, on Mar 5 2009, 04:24 AM, said:

Captain-Amar, on Mar 4 2009, 09:30 PM, said:

May I add they are looking into actually blaming THY aswell for not fixing the faulty altimiter because it apperently has happend before.

A repeat snag does not automatically shift blame to the flight crew. If the Captain accepted the use of the aircraft under MEL conditions, or, if it failed during cruise -- the flight crew is still responsible for correctly dealing with the issues at hand.

I was just saying they are looking at blaming THY for not fixing it properly. Atleast thats what being said here.

[HighFlyin]

I find it funny that many people on hear say nothing useful except RIP.

The real questions are right in front of your eyes. The Radio altimer failed when they we're around 1950MSl. AMS is at -11AMSL. This would put the aircraft about 6 miles from the threshold when everthing started to fail. The question is, why for nearly 120 seconds from the time the radio altimer failed and the auto throttle went to idle thurst to the time the plane crashed was there no corrective action taken?

Edited by Jon Daly, 06 March 2009 - 01:36 PM.

[Captain-Amar]

Euhm, as far as I understood everything happend in 100 seconds. From the moment it showed -6 feet till the aircraft laying in 3 pieces.
And yes, everybody here (in the netherlands) is wondering why they didn't notice it, they had a crew of 3.

[Cactus]

Jon Daly, on Mar 6 2009, 01:35 PM, said:

The question is, why for nearly 120 seconds from the time the radio altimer failed and the auto throttle went to idle thurst to the time the plane crashed was there no corrective action taken?

Pilot error.