101 replies to this topic

[Mul.]

[quote name='CoffeeBreakPro' date='Oct 29 2005, 05:13 AM'] [quote name='AlfFS2004' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:07 AM'] [/QUOTE]
Would you like to see my benches?


Alex [/QUOTE]
lol, sure, if they are 'smashing' the AMD64 FX series. Benchmarks aside there are other issues to consider such as up-grade path. Going the Dothan-adapter-i865 route leaves an incredibly small up-grade path, the 478 pin Northwoods are already tapped out which leaves you Dothan upgrades for as far as the bios/chipset will support it, no dual cores, no DDR2. There is computing beyond todays benchmark, a serious socket 939 onan SLI board can be built in the $2k range leaving up-grades down the road for a second vid card and dual core CPUs.

Coffee [/quote]
exactly the point I was trying to express.

Mul

[jetBlue 32]

ok, so what would be the best systemfor me, i know its my choice, but if you have 1700 dollars to spend on a computer for you, how would you spend it honestly.

[AlfaSIM-OCX]

[quote name='mul' date='Oct 29 2005, 05:13 AM'] [quote name='CoffeeBreakPro' date='Oct 29 2005, 05:13 AM'] [quote name='AlfFS2004' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:07 AM'] [/QUOTE]
Would you like to see my benches?


Alex [/QUOTE]
lol, sure, if they are 'smashing' the AMD64 FX series. Benchmarks aside there are other issues to consider such as up-grade path. Going the Dothan-adapter-i865 route leaves an incredibly small up-grade path, the 478 pin Northwoods are already tapped out which leaves you Dothan upgrades for as far as the bios/chipset will support it, no dual cores, no DDR2. There is computing beyond todays benchmark, a serious socket 939 onan SLI board can be built in the $2k range leaving up-grades down the road for a second vid card and dual core CPUs.

Coffee [/QUOTE]
exactly the point I was trying to express.

Mul [/quote]
Ahhh you guys are a bunch of AMD lovers.... HAHAHAHAHAH..... I love them too don't get me wrong, but I was having fun with the DOTHAN....

[RoniisH]

in my sig

[AlfaSIM-OCX]

[quote name='CoffeeBreakPro' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:13 AM'] [quote name='AlfFS2004' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:07 AM'] [/QUOTE]
Would you like to see my benches?


Alex [/QUOTE]
lol, sure, if they are 'smashing' the AMD64 FX series. Benchmarks aside there are other issues to consider such as up-grade path. Going the Dothan-adapter-i865 route leaves an incredibly small up-grade path, the 478 pin Northwoods are already tapped out which leaves you Dothan upgrades for as far as the bios/chipset will support it, no dual cores, no DDR2. There is computing beyond todays benchmark, a serious socket 939 onan SLI board can be built in the $2k range leaving up-grades down the road for a second vid card and dual core CPUs.

Coffee [/quote]
[url="http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=dothangaming&page=1"]http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.as...angaming&page=1[/url]


Knock yourself out and thats not running at 2.6 and also not the 533FBS CPU which is better.


Alex

[CoffeeBreakPro]

[quote name='AlfFS2004' date='Oct 29 2005, 08:43 AM'] [quote name='CoffeeBreakPro' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:13 AM'] [quote name='AlfFS2004' date='Oct 29 2005, 12:07 AM'] [/QUOTE]
Would you like to see my benches?


Alex [/QUOTE]
lol, sure, if they are 'smashing' the AMD64 FX series. Benchmarks aside there are other issues to consider such as up-grade path. Going the Dothan-adapter-i865 route leaves an incredibly small up-grade path, the 478 pin Northwoods are already tapped out which leaves you Dothan upgrades for as far as the bios/chipset will support it, no dual cores, no DDR2. There is computing beyond todays benchmark, a serious socket 939 onan SLI board can be built in the $2k range leaving up-grades down the road for a second vid card and dual core CPUs.

Coffee [/QUOTE]
[url="http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=dothangaming&page=1"]http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.as...angaming&page=1[/url]


Knock yourself out and thats not running at 2.6 and also not the 533FBS CPU which is better.


Alex [/quote]
Sorry, still not 'knocked out'. While that review does not use the current top end 'M' CPU as you mentioned, it also does not use the current top end CPUs from the FX pr P4EE line either so I am not sure what your point was.
All you are showing thus far is what has already been said, that the M processor is very capable. What you haven't shown is the 'M' processor 'smashing' the P4EE and FX CPUs or that it is 'faster than any P4 while gaming etc and even the AMD FX series' as you represented to the author of this thread who is trusting you for a hardware recommendation. I also don't see you addressing the up-grade path issue that this gentleman will eventually be forced to deal with as we all are at some point.
There is no doubt that you are proud of your new Dothan rig and have every right to be, it looks to be a very capable machine with many advantages over a traditional rig. I'm just making sure we aren't replacing level headed advice with enthusiasm.

Coffee

[AlfaSIM-OCX]

Dood LOOK at the clocks (2.3 vs 2.6 not to mention the 855 chipset and slower FSB).......... Take that 400FSB chip to 2.6 and you will see it running smoother and at higher FPS. (If you search around you will find this guys (Macci) in one of those OC forums getting insanely scores with a single card and dothan as high as SLi combos etc)

I have been pushing the the author of the thread towards an AMD x 2, but he says he just wants to game. The AMD x 2 are great for that too, just don't need a 4800 since they are 600 or so. Everybody here is just posting their rig not telling him what to get that will give him the best bang for the buck. I have suggested that an AMD rig will be harder to set up if there is going to be any Overclocking. There are very sensitive to timings as you should know. I wouldnt go intel if I had 1500 USD unless I was an enthusiast (and knockle head like me) and wanted to mess around with a Dothan and old school stuff.


Alex

[CoffeeBreakPro]

I quote you from page 1

"If you want to game for cheap get a Dothan it will Smash anything overclocked even the FX series."

and page 2

"Ok If you want the best bang for the buck I would recomend getting a P4P800SE a CT479 and A Dothan 730 or 750 (if you can afford a 760 go for it)"

You do go into the AMD64 x2 on page 4 but still end up pimping your Dothan at the end of the post.
oops

This isn't a contest between you and I and I am certainly no fan boy or 'AMD lover', of my4 PCs 2 are Pentiums. Your all lathered up over some OC'ing benchmarks that won't mean anything in 12 months when it is time to look at up-grading, not to mention not everyone is willing to OC to achieve a certain level of performance. Exaxmple, your posted benchmark with OC'ing for 3Dmark05 is within 500 points of mine at default clocks..... tomorrow I can go get a AMD64 x2 4800, can you go dual core tomorrow? That 500 points means nothing if you can't see it in a game.

Of all the recommendations given Mul's is the most sensible in my opinion. Socket 939, PCI-X, AMD64 (I prefer single core, up-grade to dual core when apps are available to justify the extra price). If you can wait a bit AMD will be releasing a new chipset that will use DDR2.

Coffee

[Mul.]

Good summary coffee.

Have you actually built a AMD K8 setup before? I have built 3 different systems based on AMD K8 and nForce 3 250/nForce 4 Ultra. They were all pretty much trouble free to setup, and once you read a guide or two overclocking was self explanitory too. Ok with intel platforms, generally the only main variables to concentrate on are fsb, vcore, divider and timings but is that enough to justify raking out money for an ageing platform with no SLI, dual core, Sata II etc?

And come on. Who will see the difference between say 117fps and 132fps? That doesn't justify raking out money on a whole new system based on p-m.

Socket 939 is the better platform, whether multimedia or gaming. It has a plethora of features, capabilities and upgradability.

Mul

Edited by mul, 29 October 2005 - 11:14 AM.

[TomohawK]

Sig

[Mul.]

and to actually answer Jetblue32's question for a system on a $1700 budget:

AMD Athlon 64 4000+ San Diego S939 Retail- $344

Epox EP-9NPA+ Nforce 4 Ultra Motherboard- $105

1GB Corsair Value PC3200 Dual Channel memory- $86

Seagate Barracuda 1200.9 160GB SATA HDD- $93

Antec P180 Case-$118

Enermax Noisetaker 485W ATX 2.0 PSU- $116

MSI NX7800GTX 256mb GDDR3- $455

LiteOn DVD Burner- $42

Liteon DVD Drive

Sony Floppy Drive $10

Windows XP SP2 OEM- $91.95

LiteOn Standard Keyboard- $5.75

Logitech MX310 Mouse- $19.99

Benq 17" 12ms Monitor- $219.99

Total: $1707.68


A very nice rig a tad over your budget.

Mul

Edited by mul, 29 October 2005 - 11:54 AM.

[AlfaSIM-OCX]

CoffeeBreakPro, on Oct 29 2005, 11:07 AM, said:

I quote you from page 1

"If you want to game for cheap get a Dothan it will Smash anything overclocked even the FX series."

and page 2

"Ok If you want the best bang for the buck I would recomend getting a P4P800SE a CT479 and A Dothan 730 or 750 (if you can afford a 760 go for it)"

You do go into the AMD64 x2 on page 4 but still end up pimping your Dothan at the end of the post.
oops

This isn't a contest between you and I and I am certainly no fan boy or 'AMD lover', of my4 PCs 2 are Pentiums. Your all lathered up over some OC'ing benchmarks that won't mean anything in 12 months when it is time to look at up-grading, not to mention not everyone is willing to OC to achieve a certain level of performance. Exaxmple, your posted benchmark with OC'ing for 3Dmark05 is within 500 points of mine at default clocks..... tomorrow I can go get a AMD64 x2 4800, can you go dual core tomorrow? That 500 points means nothing if you can't see it in a game.

Of all the recommendations given Mul's is the most sensible in my opinion. Socket 939, PCI-X, AMD64 (I prefer single core, up-grade to dual core when apps are available to justify the extra price). If you can wait a bit AMD will be releasing a new chipset that will use DDR2.

Coffee

Ok maybe I got carried away a bit........ BUT DOTHAN still OWNS lol......

PS If I really wanted dual cores I would have gotten it.... I still want to squeze the life out of my P4C800 Deluxe and the X850 XT PE and for only 350 USD and getting 7000+ marks on 3Dmark 05 is not bad at all....


Alex

[Chaos81]

Really nice recommendation Mul. Kind of amazing what you can by for that amount of money now.

[jetBlue 32]

Thanks Mul, i appreciate you looking through the argueing and giving me a good setup, i really appreciate it, and with that exact rig, would i get good framerates with scenery addons, real world weather, and a PMDG aircraft (737,747)?

[sexymacowner]

jetBlue 32, on Oct 29 2005, 03:15 PM, said:

Thanks Mul, i appreciate you looking through the argueing and giving me a good setup, i really appreciate it, and with that exact rig, would i get good framerates with scenery addons, real world weather, and a PMDG aircraft (737,747)?

fs2004 would kiss your toes with that rig.

[jetBlue 32]

haha nice

[Mul.]

it is a fantastic setup. Rest assured it'll be great for fs2004.

Mul

[jetBlue 32]

Thanks Mul, i just wish i knew how to put it together

[Speedbird_one]

Are there any places in Britain that would assemble a rig for you. as in you walk in dump the parts in frot of them and they would assemble it for you.

[Chaos81]

jetBlue 32, on Oct 29 2005, 07:30 PM, said:

Thanks Mul, i just wish i knew how to put it together

If you can follow directions, you should be able to do it. A friend of mine recently built his computer with no knowledge of how they go together at all. Just followed the instructions, and looked things up on the internet. Thing works perfectly.

You should be able to do it.